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Problems with Cultivation and Identification: Ophrys sphegodes

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Started by: Colin Barker

Go to latest contribution by Colin Barker, 29 April 2010, 15:38. Go to bottom of this page.

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Contribution from Colin Barker 26 March 2010, 10:00top / bottom of page

These two plants were found close together in the wild (French Maritime Alps). Am I right in thinking that they are both Ophrys sphegodes?

Contribution from Susan Read 27 March 2010, 13:36top / bottom of page

Even with the Delforge book (Collins 16.99) I find these confusing. Have you considered O. saratoi? Said to be local, rare and in the right area. Also hybrids with O. sphegodes occur. Perhaps someone expert will comment.

Contribution from Colin Barker 27 March 2010, 16:20top / bottom of page

Hello Susan,

I don't think it is Ophrys saratoi (Ophrys bertolonii subsp. saratoi) as I am very familiar with O. bertolonii. But perhaps it is a hybrid of O. bertolonii and O. sphegodes.

Contribution from David Nicholson 29 March 2010, 16:19top / bottom of page

Colin, I have just uploaded an image of Richard Manuel's seed grown plant of Ophrys sphegodes to the South West Show thread in case you find it helpful. If you would like to have a larger copy of the picture let me know

Contribution from David Nicholson 29 March 2010, 18:34top / bottom of page

.... and better images of the same plant by Jon Evans on the South West Show Formal Pictures thread

Contribution from Colin Barker 29 March 2010, 18:50top / bottom of page

Thanks David. This (excellent) photo is similar to my first photo. My question really concerns my second photo. Is it also O. sphegodes?

Contribution from David Nicholson 30 March 2010, 18:38top / bottom of page

I can't answer your question Colin, are the notes that Richard Manuel included with his plant at the Show (and which I pictured) any use to you?

Contribution from Colin Barker 30 March 2010, 19:32top / bottom of page

No David, I'm afraid they don't.

Contribution from John Richards 02 April 2010, 17:28top / bottom of page

Nothing like an ophrys to provoke discussion! In my view the first one is O. sphegodes s.l., but the sepals are too long, narrow and white for sphegodes s.s. It is probably O. incubacea which according to Delforges is by far the most common and widespread plant like this in the northern Med area. The second one is O. bertolonii s.l., but according to Delforges O. bertolonii s.s. is only in S Italy to Greece and it is not that anyway. It is probably O. saratoi which is a local endemic to just there according to Delforges and is 'rare and local'. Well done!!

Contribution from Colin Barker 29 April 2010, 15:38top / bottom of page

I'm pretty sure the second photo above is not Ophrys bertolonii. I've attached a photo, taken earlier this afternoon, of the form of O. bertolonii which grows in my region. They have only been in flower for a couple of days. I still think that the second photo above is O. sphegodes s.l.



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